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KLUV Dallas goes out of town for jingles
  • mjb1124mjb1124 December 2017
    After decades of having jingles produced in their backyard by TM, Tony Griffin Productions, and most recently JAM, Dallas' own Classic Hits station has gone to Seattle for the same Reelworld package airing on almost every other Entercom Classic Hits station. Gotta love cookie-cutter corporate radio.
  • ratnobratnob December 2017

    That reminds me ...

    I still cherish this bit of audio from February 2014 - sitting in Jon Wolfert's car in the Dallas suburbs, chatting about jingles (what else?), listening to KLUV when, all of a sudden, this glorious JAM resing airs.

    This, for me, is how classic hit radio sounds.
    http://geoffbarton.co.uk/files/Audio/Bob-in-Dallas/BID12-JMW-Car.mp3
  • bobgreenradiobobgreenradio December 2017
    blame cookie cutter management if you wish. but; I don't suppose you remember when every 'hot' station was buying pams?
    was that cookie cutter too?

    how bout this? they went for a better product. plain and simple. and good for them.
  • mjb1124mjb1124 December 2017
    If anything, the more "cookie-cutter" stations back then were the Drake ones, but I see your point. At least there was a bit more variation between markets back then. And when most of the CBS Classic Hits stations were airing JAM, there was at least some variation between the packages/cuts used in different markets. WOGL in particular had some real out-of-the-box choices in their last JAM composite.

    "Better product" is highly subjective. The Reelworld K-Hits stuff is okay, but I don't think it sounds better either on its own or mixed with the music than the product they had before. It's true that JAM doesn't have any fresh "off the shelf" packages to offer, but I would have loved to hear KLUV or WOGL get a new custom from JAM. Alternately, they could have gone back to TM for a new custom or one of their recent packages. Heck, KLUV already had some TM EVO cuts ready to go, but they opted not to use them.

    I do remember that fun exchange with Jon in the car. Too bad you won't be able to hear JAM over the air on future trips to Dallas. At least TM still has a few clients there.
  • WAVAWAVA December 2017
    Look at their music.
    The Jam sound no longer fits.
  • bobgreenradiobobgreenradio December 2017
    exactly. doesn't fit,
    time moves on.
  • mjb1124mjb1124 December 2017
    The playlist is still mostly '80s, with only some very safe AC-friendly '90s titles, so I don't really agree with that assessment. But the CBS stations' playlists have also become increasingly generic and interchangeable, so I guess it figures that the jingles would follow suit.
  • LenGroatLenGroat December 2017
    Bob Green Radio :

    " they went for a better product. plain and simple"

    No. They have used JAM for TWENTY years - if they still have ReelWorld 'jingles' on in 2037 - you might be right , but now you are not.

  • LenGroatLenGroat December 2017
    Ratnob:

    You are so right, and Jon should indeed be proud of it and the packages in that style - UNIQUE

    THAT cut sounded so good even listening in-car...

    We LOVE it - it lives on....

    https://soundcloud.com/len-groat/accelerate-f-f
  • bobgreenradiobobgreenradio December 2017
    len, my friend, there was a time I would swing into a mcdonalds for a burger. they use to use real meat you know; once upon a time.
    but len, NOTHING is forever even though we might wish it. today you could not pay me enough to go to a mcdonalds. it just aint meat mate.

    same goes for jingles.

    you cant breath life into an old sneaker, no matter how hard you blow, let alone put a polish on it!
    its over my friend. like it or not, it really has passed....
  • mjb1124mjb1124 December 2017
    LenGroat said:



    No. They have used JAM for TWENTY years



    I don't believe that's true in the case of KLUV. Before 2013, they had TM and Tony Griffin jingles. JAM might have done a few odds and ends for them before that (I think the Variety Pack TOH was originally for them), but wasn't their main jingle provider.

    And to be fair, Reelworld HAS been around for over two decades, so there is something to be said for their longevity. They do make a good product for CHR and Hot AC, I'll give them that. Maybe today's AC to an extent (depends on the package and station), but I just find a lot of their US output to be too overproduced and loud to really fit with older and/or lighter sounds. Plus it all seems to have the same feel to it regardless of format. The main US division could stand to take some lessons from Reelworld Europe.
  • WAVAWAVA December 2017
    LenGroat said:

    No. They have used JAM for TWENTY years


    No. FOUR years.
    mjb1124 said:

    The playlist is still mostly '80s


    But its male skewed and fairly rocky.

  • bobgreenradiobobgreenradio December 2017
    eeeehhh, 4 years? 20 years? why not 50 years!
    you know, when youre having fun, you simply lose track of time (and reality)

    heehee, HAPPY NEW YEAR FOLKS!
  • glenglen December 2017
    The did have TMs America Country at some point.
  • ratnobratnob December 2017
    http://www.aircheckdownloads.com/KLUV_Dec2017.mp3


    Thanks for the aircheck. Without wanting to re-open any stale debates, in my view these jingles don't match the sound of the classic hits format. They inject blandness.
  • tophour_briantophour_brian December 2017
    I considered the RW package for my classic hits station earlier this year but ended up doing a JAM composite. The RW jingles are fine, just a little too AC for my taste.

    WRT KLUV, remember that Entercom's WOLX bought a new JAM composite fairly recently. It's entirely possible that the RW package for Dallas was a local decision, or a call made by CBS before the merger was finalized.

    It's also worth remembering that, if there'd been a JingleMad in the early '70s, there'd have been a whole pile of people complaining about JAM in the exact same tiresome way some people now bitch about RW. Perspective, ya'll.
  • mjb1124mjb1124 December 2017
    Are you able to tell us which station you're referring to? I happen to agree with your assessment that the RW K-Hits package is too similar to their AC output, which is probably my main issue with them. I read that shortly after WCBS-FM started using this package, someone asked why they were using the "Lite FM" (WLTW) jingles. I understand wanting jingles with more of a rock texture, but I don't find the vocals and flashy effects in this package to be format-appropriate. I think you could cherry-pick cuts from Breakthrough, Z Force/World, Hyperlink, and the '90s Radio 1 packages that would work well with the current lean of the format. Even After Burner could work. TM also has a lot of suitable packages, particularly the one New Jersey 101.5 out here is using now (which hasn't gotten a demo for some reason).

    I was aware of WOLX (primarily using Breakthrough from what I've heard), however they also have a competitor (WXXM) using the RW K-Hits package, which may at least be part of the reason they went a different route. Two other pre-merger Entercom stations, KEYN and KXSN, are using the K-Hits package, as are all the former CBS stations now besides (last I heard) KOOL and KRTH. Obviously I have no authority to say who exactly is making these decisions, but there seems to be a consistent sound forming almost across the board with the Entercom lineup. Jim Ryan was/is also the one overseeing the former CBS stations both before and after the merger (and now the other Entercom stations), and he's made it clear that he's a RW fan, so he could easily be a factor.

    I think in the early '70s, it probably would have been TM getting a lot of the blame for PAMS' downfall. Then Thunder, Sundance, and JAM would get thrown into the mix. Most of us now acknowledge that the PAMS output in the last few years was lacking, but it would have been interesting to see if anyone was defending them over the new kids in town back then. Of course, those companies also inherited and/or were started by former PAMS talent, so it's not entirely a fair comparison to newcomers from Seattle arriving with the explicit intent of turning the style of radio jingles away from the "Dallas sound". I do suppose that in the '80s and '90s, there would have been complaints about stations using "modern" (for their time) JAM and TM jingles instead of PAMS resings or Johnny Mann acapellas.

    I guess I'm mostly just sad that JAM are pretty much on the fringe of the jingle industry now. But Jon has expressed in the past that JAM had its day in the sun and doesn't need to recapture that, so I guess there's something to be said for him sticking to his principles rather than trying to imitate the competition, and as long as they're able to stay in business then I guess it's all well and good. And Reelworld obviously are doing something right, even if a lot of it isn't to my tastes. I can't really complain about them dominating AC and CHR stations as their music mostly isn't my cup of tea anyway, and I do objectively think their sound fits well. It's just more grating for me to hear their sound in between '70s and '80s hits, and on the same stations where I've been accustomed to hearing the classic Dallas sound for so long. But most of these stations are still very successful, so clearly my opinion doesn't reflect that of the masses.
  • TommyTommy December 2017
    I asked an avid KLUV listener (who has no connection to the radio industry) what they thought of the new jingles. Their reply: What new jingles?

    I believe KLUV is trying to update their imaging, and some will notice the change, and some won't.

    On top of all this, I often wonder what format KLUV is going for. Just the other day I heard Third Eye Blind's "Semi Charmed Life" from 1997.

    Like most of you, I'm also sad to see JAM dwindle away in the big markets. If I'm not mistaken, the only remaining JAM station in Dallas is the one run by a local high school. (KEOM)

    But no matter what, JAM will always be the reason I got into jingles in the first place. I remember as a young 14-year-old ordering 'AC Volume 3' from JAM. I was hooked ever since. 23 years later, I still love JAM, but I love Reelworld and the new stuff from TM as well. I'd rather a station play cookie-cutter jingles than no jingles at all. :)
  • ratnobratnob December 2017
    Tommy said:

    I'd rather a station play cookie-cutter jingles than no jingles at all. :)



    Good point. Agreed.
  • IainJohnstonIainJohnston December 2017
    "Plus it all seems to have the same feel to it regardless of format"

    And to me IMPO also not just FORMAT but in TIME - something that was "critiqued" at JAM after the late 1990s
    by all sorts of people, whether one might agree on that or not.

    If I play an AircheckDownloads etc montage of a reelworld client package from the early "noughties" then a Seattle
    division one "of today", I hear very much the same "sound" with only a little "evolution" over the years, years that
    are now just as long as much of the "more mature phase" lets call it of JAM.

    "The main US division could stand to take some lessons from Reelworld Europe"

    More positively, I totally agree with THAT!

    Whether is it because the European Division is UK-based with UK people, plus has a strong association with Continental
    stations and their different-from-the-21st-century-USA (tired) radio mindset, or whether RW here has been clever
    enough to study (ex-Scottish radio) Mark Goodier's Wise Buddah model and use less abrasive vocals and have
    "gentler" processing as well as integrating UK professional singers & musicians (and even actual orchestras?)

    I never expected to hear RW in any form on the local (truly) independent station hereabouts, never mind the often
    "staid" BBC Radio Scotland! But there they are...
    :^)

  • mjb1124mjb1124 December 2017
    Not shocking that the listeners wouldn't actively notice new jingles. But for what it's worth, I've looked at comments on WOGL and KLUV's social media pages, and while there was only one comment (on the latter) complaining about the new jingles (and they specifically mentioned JAM so they're obviously one of us), there were quite a few complaints about the music changing. There hasn't been a drastic change on either since before Christmas (though WOGL does seem to have cut the last few remaining '60s songs), so could it be that the new jingles are subconsciously changing people's perceptions of the station as a whole?
  • ratnobratnob December 2017


    If I play an AircheckDownloads etc montage of a reelworld client package from the early "noughties" then a Seattle
    division one "of today", I hear very much the same "sound" with only a little "evolution" over the years, years that
    are now just as long as much of the "more mature phase" lets call it of JAM.



    Totally agree.
  • JAM+%2F+PAMSJAM / PAMS January 1
    Some of you are clinging to the lovely but naive thought that these jingle decisions are being made by multiple local program directors, after thoughtfully comparing and considering what various producers have to offer. That's how it was once done. But today these choices are often made by one person at corporate headquarters based largely on "the deal". Will they throw in some production libraries? Will they give us the jingles at a ridiculously low price? Can I just make one phone call to get this project off my desk instead of having to spend more time dealing with it? The local station PDs are told that the jingles are coming, and that's the end of it. If they truly wanted something dramatically different they could have told us that and we would have made it for them. But it never gets that far because they never get the chance. Nor do we.

    I notice that in medium and smaller markets, where individual programmers and owners can still make their own choices based on what they LIKE, the result is that they often come to JAM. And that's just fine too.
  • petewilsonpetewilson January 1
    Exactly how BBC Local Radio works over here too Jon! :L
  • Jon, appreciate you coming in on JM at what must have been near-Midnight on Hogmanay your time!

    A Happy New Year to You & Yours Sir :^)
  • it is just a commodity, after all, and market pressures rule.
    just like bread at the market. if the market i go to is expecting to get the same fee for week old bread, i go to a market with fresh goods. it can go stale on my shelf. i am not paying the shops excessive rates to pre-spoil my purchase.
    what fool pays top price for bread on its way to the hog farm?
    and yes, i know there are people that will......
  • petewilsonpetewilson January 1
    Absolutely right Bob...If you want Crap you go to the Pound Shop...Yes you save money but the items are either defective or cheap and tacky.....
    I think 2018 will be the year that the Big Boys in suits will be going here for their Jingles.......:-)

    http://www.petewilson.net/Bull.mp3

    Happy New Year!
  • glenglen January 1
    The we will will buy jingles; IF you will throw in the production for free; has been around for years. O r sometimes its done vice versa. The old barter routine.
    And unfortunately even the jock doesnt know its coming.
    Small town radio used to be fun. And some respects it still is.
    If you still find a mom/pop station that hasn't been bought up by somebody else.
  • JAM+%2F+PAMSJAM / PAMS January 2
    What you're missing with the "bread" analogy is this: They're not even tasting the bread. It doesn't matter. They're just buying it because it comes with a free can of beans.
  • glenglen January 2
    Yep.
  • glenglen January 2
    And its going to change anytime soon.
    KRKT bought a package from Canada and they received the prod package for free.
    The jingles were really bad.
    I still cannot believe that country oldie station in San Antonio actually bought same package. And so did SKY.
    KRKT dumped them and went first to TM Rough and Ready and then New Tradition from Jam.
    Both great packages.
  • perhaps bread was an abstract concept. guess I could have singled out a general motors product instead?

    funny thing is seeing someone wondering why all those other studios are getting business....
    surely everybody knows what the other shops are charging for goods...
    so let me start with product quality and price-price-price
    build a better mouse trap at a fair price and watch them fly.
    duh.
  • Wish GM would bring back the Corvair. Maybe "unsafe at any speed" but a great little car and to your point..quite inexpensive.
  • quick! who remembers the corvan? and where was the motor?
    am? am/fm? or fm in the dash? ;-))